@Angle so I usually don't call myself that but technically it's true

@cripcat @Angle
New Atheism kinda fucked atheism over a bit on that point ^^;

@colon_three @Angle same here

@bea @djsundog @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh @liate Do you guys think theres anything from religion that you would want? I mean this in a practical sense - the main example I would put forth would be things like regular meetings of the fellow minded, and a deeper shared philosophy? I know we're a fractious and disagreeable bunch, but I think it might be nice all the same.

@Angle @bea @djsundog @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh @liate are you trying to start a cult 😱

@Admin >:D

@Angle I think ritual, participatory music, and regular meetings can all be very valuable. Especially the rituals of marking life changes, like birth, coming of age, changes in relationship status and death.

@Angle @liate @celesteh @colon_three @cripcat @Sylvhem @mdhughes @ellavescent @grime_witch @guerrillarain @Admin @seasharp @staticsafe @djsundog @bea I've thought about the community aspect, but I'm not sure how that would manifest or if I would need/want it to be all also atheists.

@bea @djsundog @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh @liate @Angle Also I get that feeling of connection/awe from really good art. It's too bad people want to schmooze though.

@Angle @bea @djsundog @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh @liate This exists - The Sunday Assembly. http://www.sundayassembly.com/story

@liate @celesteh @colon_three @cripcat @Sylvhem @mdhughes @grime_witch @guerrillarain @Admin @seasharp @staticsafe @forestine @djsundog @bea @Angle I was at a service they did at Greenbelt (a christian festival!) once. It didn't seem a great replacement tbh.

@ellavescent Yeah I'm gonna try them out. We'll see what I think though. :/

@Angle I definitely miss some things about church. I also the altered state I got from worship music. I stopped playing guitar when I lost my faith because that's all I knew to use it for.

@Angle @djsundog @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh @liate

hanging out in buildings with really high ceilings

i love that shit

@bea @Angle @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh @liate I do miss ready access to a big honking pipe organ with three octaves of pedals in a huge room, now that you mention it

@djsundog @Angle @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh @liate

mmm yeah that's good shit too

i can't play but i AM a fan of organ music

hit me with that bach tbqh

@bea @Angle @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh @liate music kept me in the church an extra decade after I'd realized I thought it was nonsense, and I was a preacher's kid ;)

@Angle @liate @celesteh @colon_three @cripcat @mdhughes @ellavescent @grime_witch @guerrillarain @Admin @seasharp @staticsafe @forestine @djsundog @bea I don't think so. I think I found this kind of things in my political groups.

@Angle

I'll take the crowdfunding (and perhaps tax exemption (but for all muahaha - I share this with the anarchists))

This has the potential to shine a light on the potential schisms, though... https://linuxrocks.online/media/g0S7wh9cyD9WEsEHMtg

@bea @djsundog @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @colon_three @celesteh @liate @Angle no, I'm happy as is

@Angle @bea @djsundog @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh @liate Yes! CONGREGATIONAL SINGING!

@Azure

Immediately evokes...

https://youtu.be/6GkK8wS2WWc?t=62

@liate @celesteh @colon_three @cripcat @Sylvhem @mdhughes @ellavescent @grime_witch @guerrillarain @seasharp @staticsafe @forestine @djsundog @bea @Angle @Azure Unsubscribe 🙃

@Admin
Yeah I regretted ating so many people almost immediately... XD

@Angle hahaha, you’re good 😊

@Angle good luck though!

@Angle Also the local group of random mathematicians, historians, engineers, and whatnot actually serve as a regular meeting with SOME shared values, though most of those are discourse norms, actively seeking unusual ideas, and employing things like the 'I don't understand anything they said, there must be something wrong with me." heuristic.

@Azure
I have one of those groups!
We have: A Software engineer, a computer scientist, a political scientist, a pure mathematician, two historians (one minored theater with a historic specialization in the classics, the other education with a historic specialization in american modern history), a botanist, a pharmacist, a chemist (who also minored in education), a proper classicist and two normal people we are tangential to :D
We play tabletop games and eat food every weekend.

@Irick We just get together and chat. And argue. And argue some more. And argue a bit more. Also occasionally sing. Sometime we're planning to go solve the Giant Rubik's Cube..

@Azure
I mean those things happen too :3
Except the giant Rubik's cube. That seems unique to your group.

@Angle @bea @djsundog @forestine @staticsafe @seasharp @Admin @guerrillarain @grime_witch @ellavescent @mdhughes @Sylvhem @cripcat @colon_three @celesteh
@liate

No. Even when I went through my panentheist phase, I was always against religion.

@Angle I miss the fellowship and community support. I've thought about checking out the Unitarian church to see if I could get that without the religious trappings.

@tek I grew up a unitarian! They're pretty all right, at least the ones I'm familiar with. Expect a fair amount of woo, though. :/

@Angle Thanks for the heads up. 😀

I grew up Southern Baptist, and went to church with my mom when I was visiting a few months ago. It just left me frustrated and sad.

@interfly Yeah i don;t know what either of those are tbqh. XD

@Angle

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignosticism

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theological_noncognitivism

Basically, ideas about metaphysics tend to be ill-defined and/or unfalsifiable.

Why do you ask? :)

@interfly I wanted to hold a conversation about what trappings of religion people found valuable and missed - weekly meetings, pipe organs, etc. If you check the replies to my first post you can probably find it - its the one with way too many @'s. XD

@Angle

Oh, we never went to church. Thankfully, I was allowed to figure things out for myself.

@Angle

In fact, I'm actively against organized humanism too. It comes across too much as Catholicism for infidels. And for the secular/atheist/agnostic/free-thinker movements, I think they shall soon become about personalities rather than epistemics/epistemology.

I would encourage personal, individual explorations of rationality, philosophy, and the like. Skepticism as a process is much more important than atheism itself and or any group claiming to represent it

@Angle

But that being said, I won't hold back my disdain for religion for fear of being labeled a "new atheist".

There is nothing "new" about atheists calling out religious lies, hypocrisy, and oppression.

We have documents from India dating back to 5 B.C.E. that argue against the immorality of the priest caste.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charvaka

@Ulfra_Wolfe What too? :0

@Angle I believe in gods and spirits, but it's not like, earth-shaking or universe-creating gods... mostly. Hell, they could be fictions in our head. But those fictions have real influence over our behavior, our thoughts, our hope... and hope is the hardest thing to create. There is a very real possibility that spirits and gods are real, though, and the more I learn about past lives, the more I think there are other worlds out there.

@Angle The only thing I am comfortable with labeling myself as, is an eternal student. I am always learning, and I will always be learning, and there will always be more to learn. The cosmos is just too complex and awe-inspiring.

@Ulfra_Wolfe @Angle *gives you a Mona Point*(

@kara_dreamer @Angle @kel Indeed. Kara has experiences which she and Kel choose to regard as "spiritual", although I try to remind them that there is no need to invoke the supernatural to explain them.